No worries, I only know it from trying to establish identify while taking reports.
So I’ve been exploring alternative heating and energy supply for my house.
Right now, I burn propane in a forced-air system. 750 gallons of the stuff to get through the heating season. We’ve got some lossiness in the ducting and basement insulation (like my totally uninsulated sill joists that I’m gonna fix), but still, it’s shaping up to be a lot of propane. We also have a separate central air unit.
Propane is expensive and the market is volatile, so I have a vested interest in getting away from it.
Natural gas is not an option at my house, nor is it likely to be at any point in the near or mid-future.
So, that has all lead me to heat pumps. Initially, I was driving towards a ground-source heat pump (AKA geothermal) because it’s a wicked efficient system that’s also wicked cool.
Just got my estimate back - $27k to install a geothermal system in my house. Payoff is probably around 11 - 12 years, which ain’t bad, but still - that’s a lot of money.
So now I’m thinking air-source heat pumps, which have improved dramatically in the last few years and are actually viable for cold climates now. The advantage is that those are way cheaper - like $6k or $7k. They’re maybe half as efficient as a GSHP, but at 1/4 the price, it’s a more attractive payoff window.
The goal in either case is to pair with a solar installation, taking advantage of the NY-Sun program while it’s around. Efficient electric heating and solar to get close to a net-zero house.
So now I’m balls deep in researching ASHP setups (central ducted versus ductless), considering the degree of supplementation required, and a million other things while also scheduling solar consultations.
Homeownership: it’s like that.
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Instead of giving up on the geothermal right away, I would research ways to help pay for it. For starters, this rebate might become a real thing.
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That price includes the rebate. $1500 per ton of heating/cooling, and we’ve sized a 3 ton system for me.
You can get low-interest financing for projects like this through EnergyStar, but the prospect of financing $27k at even 3.5% for 10 or 15 years is…well, less than ideal, doubly when looking at also adding solar.
The question will really be one of total cost, which is hard as balls to estimate. An ASHP uses more electricity than a GSHP, so I would need a larger solar bank to offset it. I could probably get away with a 5 or 6 kW system with the GSHP - might be 8 or 9 kW for the ASHP. So the question is: how do I make the best deal for me?
Preliminary numbers are making me lean in the ASHP + larger solar direction, because New York has both a 25% tax credit and a 40 cents per watt discount for solar systems. That’s a lot of savings on top of the 30% federal tax credit.
I could also try finding someone to install open-loop geothermal instead of closed-loop, but then I have to figure out where the fuck to discharge like 20,000 gallons of water a day.
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I read this as “alternative healing and energy supply” the first time. Thought I was in the stupid emails thread for a second.
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The question is, how much orgone energy are you wasting with an open loop system, versus a closed loop?
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The answer is to always construct more pylons.
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Saw this and read “healing” too. >_<
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Maybe just find something else to burn that doesn’t cost as much? Wood? Babies? Hell, even oxygen burns, and that shit is free!
Um… oxygen burns?
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Shhhhhh, let him figure it out on his own.
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My parents bought a wood stove after an ice storm knocked their power out for a week, and now they use it as their main heat source during the winter. As long as you don’t leave the door open, it’s super clean and doesn’t smell like smoke.
The ashes and bits of wood can get a tad messy, so I would avoid it if you have carpet. But if you have hard wood or tile, just sweep around the stove real quick every day or so.
House layout is something else to consider. Theirs is tall and open, so a centralized heat source works. I’m not sure how effective it would be if your house was wider or had a bunch of smaller rooms.
He has a wood burning stove already, I suspect he got tired of feeding it. 
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Hahaha, never mind then!
Yeah, fuck that nonsense. I have woods on my property, so I could harvest my own firewood (though I can’t sustain it as a sole fuel source because I don’t have enough woods), but ain’t nobody got time for that.
As it is, the wood furnace would provide supplemental heat on days that hit single digits Farenheit.
And buying wood isn’t that cheap. $200/cord would be crazy cheap, and I’m gonna need at least 5 cord to get through a winter as a sole heat source. $250/cord is a more common price around here.
On my final loan document, because of how it was laid out, I wasn’t sure if I had to pay an additional $700 on top of what I was already expecting I’d have to pay, or if that $700 was already included in my total monthly amount.
Turns out, after two frantic phone calls, and a couple hours of almost nausea-inducing anxiety later, the $700 is already included, but because of how the document was formatted, it appeared like it was a separate additional charge.
Kate, dunno where you got that understanding. We intend to be here for a good, long while. We never intended to do the “own a house for 5 years then upgrade” thing. The concept of a starter house is actually kind of repugnantly consumerist… but whatever works I guess.
As for the posts about “other” fuels… wood is more expensive, oil is more expensive, pure electric is more expensive, and natural gas is unavailable. So, no, we can’t “just” burn something cheaper, actually. And have you SEEN the going rate for babies? We could heat with propane for 10-20 years for the price of ONE of those things.
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It’s not really consumerist at all, I see it more as economically conscious. Not everyone wants to buy a 4 bedroom house on the off chance they have kids. If you decide to have kids in 5-10 years then maybe it’s time to move to a larger house.
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Got a final move out date for the sellers, May 7th. Holycrap!
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I think that may have been one of the things we were thinking at the time. Honestly, my recollection of the first half to two-thirds of last year is mostly a haze of stress and numbers, so conversations are long gone.
We’re thinking about building an addition now instead of selling and moving. Probably have to knock out the back deck to do it, though. It’s a ways off, though, and a lot can change in a few years.
I predict at least 10 years in the place, so that’s my ideal payoff window. I’m angling for a net-zero house, which I’m willing to bet could fetch a substantially higher price in the market. But I’d also like to reap that benefit while I’m there.
The geothermal thing is a really neat technology, and if I were more handy with things like wiring 30 amp circuits and HVAC, I’d consider getting the stuff and installing it myself. That’d cut the price in half. But that’s a big step, and I don’t want to fuck it up.
We’ll see what the ASHP can bring to the table.
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