GeekNights Endorses Warren

scarcity has nothing to do with it, insurers aren’t directly responsible for allocating resources, only cash, which is a social construct. If our government put ethics first, then every person would have housing, food, and health care, and cost would never matter, because both cash and value are arbitrary. Workers need to be compensated for the labor to provide these services, but them acting as a for profit entity ensures that the “value” of the product is inflated, which is bullshit because no human should be denied something like water even if they are destitute.

A post-scarcity society would make this current hierarchy of capital much, much easier to render obsolete (the rich sure as fuck aren’t going to let it go without a fight), but even in our scarcity-real world there is an outrageous amount of resources not distributed even remotely equally (and hey, maybe we don’t start by distributing perfectly equally, but there’es enough that a majority of humanity has no reason to be destitute).

but it is good to know that this is some sort of regulation that ensures insurance companies are doing their job (although I am highly skeptical it is fairly enforced)

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Nearly half of Australians living with depression, anxiety and other mental health conditions have skipped medication or therapy because of cost, according to a study by James Cook University and the NSW Bureau of Health Information.

As had more than 30 per cent of those with asthma and emphysema, 27 per cent of those with diabetes, 25 per cent with arthritis and 20 per cent of cancer patients, according to the study recently published in the Australian Journal of Primary Health .

Basically universal healthcare is not good enough.

Besides, there is literally zero chance of the right not vehemently opposing any and every piece of healthcare reform put forth by the left. On they off chance they actually get something through, they might as well make it something meaningful.

You do know you’re trying to lecture me about my own country, right? The problems that to you are an abstract issue you googled up to use as a bludgeon, are literally things that have happened to me and the people around me. You know, the same issues that I used to get told didn’t matter, when I would point them out when people were saying “We need universal healthcare like Australia!”

Hey, there’s a plan, let’s talk about the issues I went through and hoops I had to jump through trying to get mental healthcare, and how we could solve those problems since we have an existing base to work from on these things, I’m sure you’d be real interested.

Nah, just kidding. I already know you don’t care, because it’s harder to weaponize my lived experience in a useful way.

Like, what, a plan that’s single payer only, eliminates the insurance industry, and has less than zero percent chance of passing, because apparently somewhere between twitter and here, we forgot that the democratic party is a broad tent, and half of them won’t support that? You think that the republicans are either going to sign on to Bernie’s plan - insofar as he has one, rather than slogans - or just vanish in a puff of guillotine smoke?

That argument would be more convincing, if not for the fact that you’re basically saying “Hey, this propably won’t pass, so let’s go for something that DEFINITELY won’t pass, because it will mean more!” No it fucking won’t! It’ll mean approximately fuck all but a bunch of dead trees for the print-outs. This isn’t twitter, it’s not like doing something real popular that dies in a week is still great because a bunch of people looked at your soundcloud and subbed to your patreon.

I get that incremental change isn’t popular with the brookyn-trust-fund-cokehead-with-a-podcast set, but there’s a small, fine, yawning gulf of difference between “I wish it went further, but it’s a start” and “This is meaningless”. And I know you know that, I’m just frankly kind of baffled for what else to say, or why you might be pretending to be so blind to it.

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You know what, I was going to lash back, but that was just being a bit hurt by someone I generally respect(and to some degree, admire) lashing out at me that harshly. But that wouldn’t be helpful. Instead, tell me precisely how I’m, apparently, the most toxic person on this board(which is more than a little hurtful, considering there’s someone on this board whose name came up when I got swatted a few years back, which I’ve spoken about here). What am I doing wrong, in your eyes?

In fairness, I should also tell you - four people so far have explicitly told me that you, personally, are the reason they don’t want to participate in political discussions about the Dem primaries here anymore. I’ve also been avoiding it for, honestly, months.(I think? Not exactly counting, I just dump the thread to read without touching it.) If you want to talk about that, fair, if not, I’m leaving it there, no more said.

And I think you might be right, in a roundabout way, I was to harsh on Ika. They tried to lecture me about my own lived experience, and that made me see red, since I’ve been open about my mental health, and hardly a secret where I lived, I figured it was obvious that they’d done something that seemed intentionally cruel - but, that may have been me having too constrained of a view, it may not have even crossed their mind that they were talking down to me about it. I’m sorry, Ika, I was too harsh to you. That wasn’t fair, I got mad when I shouldn’t have, and I should have given you the benefit of the doubt.

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Simmer down a bit in here. We’re all on the same side of what is literally an existential fight.

I don’t think anyone here is arguing in bad faith. But argue to clarify policy or strategy or ethics. Everyone here (had better) agree on basic first principles. Health care is and must be a right to all humans.

The only debate I’m interested in here is how we achieve that.

There’s validity to incremental progress even with heavy compromise. There’s also validity to big bang approaches. Elections are complicated, and actual concrete public policy is even more complicated.

The US has an utterly fucked up political system. Our dirty laundry has aired to the world for the entire lives of everyone in this forum. We are the last place to look to for examples of good governance, sane systems, or pragmatic public policy. Our government is dysfunctional to the point that we had a civil war not that long ago, and we have a multi-decade complete paralysis of much of our government. Our elections are decided by the most ignorant and least informed voters in a handful of “swing” districts. Very stupid ideas are very popular with American voters.

The truth is we don’t know what will work. A big bang health care approach could very well re-elect a dangerous idiot. Or it could usher in a new era of American prosperity. The debate now should center around:

  1. How do we take back power
  2. How do we give everyone health care
  3. How fast can we feasibly do #2 without sabotaging #1

There isn’t an answer. There is just a debate, then a primary, and then a general election.

No one here thinks universal health care isn’t necessary. (If you do, keep quiet or I’ll probably ban you). Remember that.

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Lmao fuck you dude.

I can’t imagine what it would be like to have the gall to go into an American political thread and get mad at people “trying to lecture [you] about [your] own country”. Or to tell me that bringing up stats about people skipping mental health treatment for financial reasons is just an abstract issue to me, assuming it’s not something I’ve done myself. Or that the US’s shitty mental health services didn’t devastate my family through much of my childhood. That I don’t have a close relative with schizophrenia, putting my entire family at greatlyincreased risk.

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I was abrasive and for that I’m sorry.

The main story I’ve seen is your continuous seething resentment for anyone left of your position. No one here works for Jacobin. No one is a member of Chapo Trap House. No one is a “bernie bro” (at least as far as I am concerned). You continually wrap any valid criticism of positions as irrational or emotional which is honestly offensive and belies a lack of diligence to learn more.

For example, “insofar as Bernie has a plan for Medicare For All”, you can read the actual text of the bill he wrote.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/1129/text

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&

https://twitter.com/twinklingtania/status/1175857717698682880?s=21

It just goes to show that wealthy members of the LGBTQIA+ community are willing to throw everyone under the bus if it helps them. Honestly there are so many members of the community that couldn’t afford a fraction of that cost under whatever plan Warren has.

https://twitter.com/singlepayertom/status/1176878527209099269

Also this is the best she has when it comes to communicating about healthcare?

Of course Warren doesn’t want to be straightforward and say that she’s going to raise taxes in order to pay for her healthcare plan. Warren saying that her plan would increase taxes would go viral instantly. Can you imagine the damage that clip would do to her campaign in the general election? How many ads would Trump make using that? Remember George H. W. Bush’s “No New Taxes?” claim?

And shame on Stephen Colbert for continuing the media’s attempt to get her to say that taxes will go up. He’s sympathetic to her, he may even like her and agree with her, but he wants that soundbite of Warren saying “Yes, your taxes will go up.” That’s his job. He wants a juicy quote from Warren that will be endlessly replayed. He wants a sensationalist and controversial quote in order to boost his ratings. Stephen Colbert has a professional and monetary incentive to get Warren to say “Your taxes will go up.”

At least Colbert acknowledges raising taxes for healthcare is good. Most media outlets just assume that more taxes is a bad thing. That’s a fundamentally Republican point of view of taxes.

So yeah, I applaud Elizabeth Warren for once again not giving anyone a harmful soundbite that plays into Republican ideology. And tim (singlepayertom) should realize what Colbert and every other media outlet is doing when they try to get her to admit that.

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Elizabeth Warren on her “Native Heritage”

https://youtu.be/4oIVinDXzOw

And Responses from the Native American community

And a reading list tied to an article

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https://www.ajc.com/news/national-govt--politics/warren-campaign-office-new-hampshire-broken-into/3mTPXZcWpU9cCwCVyHiY5N

I work within walking distance of her office in Manchester, NH. That neighborhood is the meth capital of New England. It is 100% methheads or meth-adjacent crime.

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I’m increasingly optimistic about Warren’s chances in Iowa and New Hampshire.

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I am pretty sure my opinion on whether we are all F’ed or we are going to have a landslide larger than Nixon in 72 changes by the millisecond…

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Same… I am vacillating heavily between nihilism of “fuck it christian fascist capitalists have won better get used to it” and “oh my god we might stop this insanity” in the same breath.

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Edit: I sometimes do this, where I post the bare minimum and hope people will get what I mean. I don’t think it’s effective.

I don’t alternate between anything. Whoever wins next election I’ll be fighting them. Whether it’s the orange hitler or biden or berine or warren. They’re all to my right.

I’m rooting for the democrats because I think I’ll have more success fighting them than the right. Their ideas and mine are more compatible and maybe I can win more of them over.

Never the less what to do now remains the same. Direct action.

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